Courageous Conversations at the Prop 8 Trial
February 8, 2010
By guest poster Laura Kanter
Note by Julia: Laura is one of our Deputy Field Organizers, Equality Program volunteers committed to empowering and training leaders in their communities to mobilize for a more progressive California.
Two weekends ago I had the opportunity to attend Camp Courage in Santa Barbara. Camp Courage is a two-day training for activists and organizers, sponsored by the Courage Campaign Institute, that was born from the passage of prop 8. Since the first training in January, 2009, Camp Courage has been held in Los Angeles, Fresno, San Diego, Oakland, East Los Angeles, Washington D.C., and Santa Barbara with over 1,600 new community organizers.
The training is based on the work of Marshall Ganz, a Harvard professor who is credited with having developed the highly successful “Camp Obama(s)” that swept across the country, empowering and training thousands of Americans to get involved at the grassroots level to help Obama win his campaign.
The training teaches team building, leadership development, and grassroots organizing, but at its foundation there is a whole lot more going on. The underlying theme of Camp Courage is about the telling of our personal stories (the story of self) to connect with and move others (the story of us) to then act concretely to create social change (the story of now). The training begins by providing attendees the tools to develop and share their own stories, their “story of self,” and this is where the journey begins. Ganz, who grew up hearing the stories of Passover and of the Holocaust as a child, learned about movement building working in the civil rights movement in Mississippi in the 1960’s.
It is by telling our “story of self,” according to Ganz, that we communicate with others at the level of shared values, not in an abstract way, but as we live them, allowing listeners to feel and identify with us. Our story of self is not just about the teaching of a concept or morals but about “the teaching of our hearts.” Ganz believes that through this process we become empowered and can move ourselves and others from inertia to hope to concrete action.
Telling our stories “is not about following a script, but about choosing how to handle deviations from a script.” We know, all too well, that if we don’t tell our own stories, they will be told for us. We saw this happen with the tweets and analyses coming from the prop 8 supporters during the trial. It is by promoting this distorted interpretation of our lives that they have succeeded in denying our rights and it is all they have to make their case against us. I am convinced that the telling of our stories is one of the most important things we can do to empower ourselves and others and create change.
“Some people say, “I don’t want to talk about myself,” but if you don’t interpret to others your calling and your reason for doing what you’re doing, do you think it will just stay uninterpreted? No. Other people will interpret it for you. You don’t have any choice if you want to be a leader. You have to claim authorship of your story and learn to tell it to others so they can understand the values that move you to act, because it might move them to act as well.”
From my perspective as a clinical social worker, the process of developing and sharing our stories of self within a community of supportive others, creates change on many levels that will continue long after the training ends. Tremendous healing occurs as attendees are finally celebrated for who they are in a society that for the most part has disempowered us. For centuries storytelling has been regarded as a healing art and has been used universally as a way for people to cope with loss. If there is one thing our community has in common, it is that we have experienced a great deal of loss throughout our lives. The passage of prop 8 was a huge and deeply felt loss. Some psychologists believe that we don’t actually “get over” major losses. Rather, they are incorporated into our personal narratives and help us to make meaning of our lives. We are not only healed and empowered by the telling, but also by bearing witness and learning we are not alone.
The connection between Camp Courage and the trial occurred to me many times over the weekend training as I heard people share their stories of struggle and grief and hope and love. Their stories echoed those of Kristin Perry, Sandra Steir, Paul Katami and Jeffrey Zarrillo, the four plaintiffs in the prop 8 case. When they testified, along with Ryan Kendall, who spoke about being forced into conversion therapy, they were telling their stories of self. Mayor Jerry Sanders of San Diego told his story of self when he testified about his change of heart from being against marriage equality to against prop 8 after his daughter came out to him. We also heard stories of self and stories of us in the expert testimonies. For many of us this was the first time we were hearing (or reading about) our stories as told by psychologists, sociologists, economists, historians, scholars, political scientists, and lawyers. Heck – we might even say that the defense witnesses helped tell our stories, to the chagrin of the defense attorneys no doubt. Even the bizarre William Tam told our story as his testimony exposed the hurtful lies and propaganda espoused by the prop 8 campaign that have so deeply impacted our lives.
The story of self, us and now began even before Ted Olson’s opening statements. The first stories came from the 138,574 letters we wrote with the help of the Courage Campaign, asking Judge Walker to broadcast the trial.
We then saw people sharing their stories and making connections as they got involved by commenting on the Trial Tracker blog posts. People across the country started conversations and are now forming teams in places outside of California. And the story of self and us, is now being told through the trial re-enactments.
One of the many calls to action advocated by the Courage Campaign is for us to have “Courageous Conversations.” Basically, a Courageous Conversation occurs when we take the time to bravely share our story of self with our families, friends and other people in our communities. I would say that many courageous conversations took place during the trial. The good news is that these conversations are still going on. The stories of self and us are becoming the story of now.
Harvey Milk got how important it is to tell people about ourselves, and so do the fine people of the Courage Campaign.
“Stories not only teach us how to act – they inspire us to act. Stories communicate our values through the language of the heart, our emotions. And it is what we feel – our hopes, our cares, our obligations – not simply what we know that can inspire us with the courage to act.”
What’s your story?
You can get more information about Camp Courage here.
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1.
Richard W. Fitch | February 8, 2010 at 5:59 pm
Regardless of the verdict in the current case, we have already won in an incalculable way by being here and being heard.
2.
Ronnie | February 8, 2010 at 6:08 pm
All thats left is to be seen…..We need show them not only will not be silenced but we will NOT hide….we will NOT go away……yeah?
3.
Felyx | February 8, 2010 at 6:01 pm
Rich, where in NC?
4.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 6:22 pm
Felyx, you must be aiming that question at me. My husband and I live just outside of Fayetteville/Ft. Bragg. A little town called Hope(less) Mills. What about you?
5.
Felyx | February 8, 2010 at 7:35 pm
I am in either Raleigh or Asheville (Burnsville) at times. Thank you for asking.
Your Neighbor,
Felyx
6.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 7:43 pm
Are you on Facebook? Get up with me there also.
7.
Felyx | February 8, 2010 at 7:49 pm
What are the chances you will be at the Raleigh in May for the Day of Action?
Felyx
8.
Felyx | February 8, 2010 at 7:51 pm
Not as of yet. You can email me at roseangelboy yahoo. FB will have to wait for now.
9.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 8:01 pm
When in May? What day of the week? BZ and I may be able to get there if we have a date far enough in advance.
10.
Felyx | February 8, 2010 at 8:07 pm
http://www.equalitync.org/
Equality North Carolina
Day of Action
Tuesday, May 25, 2010
11.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 8:22 pm
Felyx, I am marking it on our calendar now. Thank you so much.
12.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 6:20 pm
Okay, here goes. I will attempt to tell my story briefly here, and if any of you have any questions, you can ask me. I am on Facebook, and a member of the P8TT group there.
I am a gay man, born in March of 1963 in West Virginia. And before you ask me how close that is to Roanoke, or to Richmond, please be aware that Virginia and West Virginia are two different states and have been since 20 June, 1863. And yet, in many ways they are so much alike. Growng up, my earliest memories involve my adoptive “father” calling me all sorts of derogatory names, most of them slurs used against gay men. When I was 7, he added physical abuse into the mix. Then at the age of 12, a few months after I reported seeing him performing oral sex on my 8 year old niece, and only a few weeks fter he caught me with my first boyfriend, he began to rape me. This continued until I graduated from high school and went to San Diego for boot camp with the US Navy. In high school, in an effort to fit in, I began dating a girl who was less than a year younger than me, but due to the month of her birth, was two years behind me in school. We got married while I was home on Christmas leave. However, between the time of my engagement, and the date of my LEGAL wedding, I fell in love. While out on my recruit liberty weekend in boot camp, I met a man who had served in-country with the USMC during Vietnam. Finally, someone who treated me as if I were a worthwhile human being–someone who loved me. I moved in with him, and it never failed–if there was something he saw that I needed or wanted, I didn’t even have to open my mouth. I would come home from the base to find that my uniforms had been washed, dried, ironed, and put in hanger bags to keep the lint off of them. I would come home to find supper waiting for me. He walked me to the bus every morning to make sure I got on it safely and could get to the base in time for roll call. He was there in the afternoon to walk me home. He did all those little things for me that you do for your husband or wife when you love someone enough to marry them. After I was discharged, he told me to go back to West Virginia and handle my “family obligations” and he would be there waiting for me when I returned. By the time I was able to get everything taken care of, he had been offered a promotion on his job that would take him to my hometown in West Virginia, but he died in a plane crash before he made it. My whole world fell apart at the seams on the day I got the letter from his parents. After that, I went through 27 years of heartache, being used and abused by everyone who only wanted one thing out of me. No, they did not always want sex, but they all wanted money, or alcohol, or something else. None of them, it turns out, wanted me. And I swore to myself that if I ever found anyone again who treated me like Joe did, that I would NOT leave this time, no matter what he said. If he told me that I had “family obligations” to take care of, I would look him in the eye and tell him, “My family obligations are standing directly in front of me, and I’m not going anywhere!” Finally, on 15 February, 2009, I finally found someone who has treated me the way Joe did. But the State of North Carolina refuses to let us get married because we are two men. Why should that matter? We are both adults, we know who we love, and we both know that love does not discriminate on the basis of gender. So why is it that if either one of us gets sick, or gets injured, and ends up in the hospital, that we cannot act as each other’s voice? Why are we forbidden to stay after normal visiting hours when other spouses are allowed, even invited, to stay? Why do we have to run the risk of someone running either one of us out of our home if one of us dies? That is not fair. That is not moral. That is not constitutional. That is denying us the same protections that straight marriages enjoy. This is why I am fighting, and why I will not give up the fight until every man and woman over the age of eighteen can LEGALLY marry the man or woman of his or her heart’s choice. Only when we have full marriage equality will all marriages be fully valid, and valued at their full worth. Only when we have full marriage equality will all marriages be able to revel in their strength.
We are going to Connecticut this year to get married, even though it will not change our LEGAL status here in North Carolina. At least, not yet. We are doing it so that when we do have full marriage equality in the US, we will already have the paperwork in hand to have our marriage legally recognized here. But everyone also deserves the right to get married in the location of his or her choice, rather than having to go out of state to get married because that is the only place to get it done. Shouldn’t y 85-year-old mother-in-law have the right to see her only son get married to the one who makes his heart skip a beat? I think so.
13.
Kathleen | February 8, 2010 at 7:18 pm
Richard, thank you so much for sharing your story. I have no words to express how full my heart is after reading this…. xoxoxo
14.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 7:29 pm
Anytime. And I was so moved by yours. You see, this group here on the P8TT site, and also in the FB group, has become something that I have not really had anywhere else–not only my family, but also my community. I cannot express how deeply everyone here has touched my life, and how much you have all given me. xoxoxoxox
15.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 6:05 am
Dear Richard:
This is why I think all of you are so very brave when you tell your stories. You could have come through your experiences bitter and angry at the entire world, and yet you are loving and kind … and even adopted this ol’ straight girl to be your sister.
Love you much,
Fiona
16.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 9, 2010 at 9:03 pm
And I am looking forward t wenI have the tim this week to it don and read your ebook that I downladed to BZ’s computer from Scribd. I am going to upload some of my mystery shorts to Scribd. One question. do you have to type them in, or can you upload them from a file? I have been scanning them in on BZ’s computer and transferring them to mine via CD, but wasn’t sure how to upload them to Scribd. And of course, I will let you know when I get them there. Would love to see if you have any suggestions on them when you get a chance to read them.
17.
fiona64 | February 10, 2010 at 6:19 am
Hi, Richard. You can upload the PDF; that’s what I did with “Born of War” because all I had was a hard copy (it was written in 1995). My other books are on Smashwords, which allows for more download formats. I can PM you a link on FB.
I feel very fortunate to have collaborated with a now-famous historian before he made a name for himself. :-)
Love,
Fiona
18.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 6:22 pm
Drat! Forgot to hit the subscribe button again! I can be so dumb sometimes!
19.
Alan E. | February 8, 2010 at 6:28 pm
I am Alan Eckert, not anybody else. My experinces are mine, though they may have been shared with others, and nobody else has seen, done, or heard exactly the same things I have experienced. I will make my own paths, and there is no one out there who can make me do otherwise unless I ask for help. Many of my opinions are formed from experience, and many have been rationalized. I am open to new ideas, and I alone can judge the weight that others’ opinions have upon my thoughts and ideas.
20.
Ronnie | February 8, 2010 at 6:30 pm
I will post something…I’m not sure what yet…I have told my story several times so if I repeat it…I want it to be in a really good way…Dopty-daddy…you should sell your story for like a movie deal or something…..lol……<3
21.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 6:52 pm
Thanks, Ronnie. I am actually working on the first book of my autobiography. It will be collectively known as the “Homefront” trilogy, and Volume One will be called “Terrorism on the Homefront,” because that is exactly what child abuse is–in-home terrorism.
22.
Ronnie | February 8, 2010 at 6:58 pm
I want a signed copy…lol…I’ve been working on a book too since I was 16 about being diverse in America..sort’ve a auto-bio…but will read as fiction…I’m not a writer, meaning I can’t do things by the book(pun intended)…I write what I feel and in my own little 21 cent. language…hehe…but I think I want it to become series.
23.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 7:05 pm
Then, Ronnie, create a Scribd account and publish an excerpt of it. You never know who might see it there, and you may end up with a publishing deal.
24.
Ronnie | February 8, 2010 at 7:10 pm
I never thought about that…I’ll most def. look into that
25.
BobbiCW | February 8, 2010 at 8:03 pm
To follow up on how important it is that others hear our stories…
A little over 10 years ago a friend from church happened to also be a state legislator. He was a good Republican who didn’t think there was a need for hate crimes laws for lgbts. Hate crime laws were what we were trying to get passed at the time, and the legislature had a public hearing about it.
There was the usual drivel from the wingers, and from our side there was a parade of people who told their personal stories about hate crimes they had endured. Our friend’s heart was touched, and he eventually voted for passage of the legislation.
He told us (since we were friends from church) that he never would have voted for the hate crime law if he hadn’t heard our stories from our own lips.
You never know when the simple truth will slap someone upside the head hard enough to change their mind.
26.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 8:11 pm
Thank you BobbiCW. You have just given the reason for the need for Equality Teams in a nutshell.
27.
Marlene Bomer | February 9, 2010 at 2:21 pm
I had a similar experience two years ago at a Lobby Day for Ohio’s version on ENDA.
I was talking to Cliff Hite, who’s the state rep for one of the state’s most conservative areas. I figured with him being a GOPer he’d be antagonistic — and I was pleasantly surprised to find he was an ally!
Suffice it to say, he was one of a bare few Republicans in the Ohio House to vote the bill out of committee AND pass it in the House.
Unfortunately, the Ohio Senate’s GOP controlled and the Senate President (a black man IIRC!) won’t allow it to come to a vote at all!
28.
BobbiCW | February 10, 2010 at 3:22 am
We often forget (given the fact that most wingers are Republicans) that not every Republican is a winger. We need to remember not to stereotype them simply based on the party they belong to. The McCain women are a perfect example.
The bottom line is this: Don’t hesitate to contact your legislators of either party. You never know when you’ll find a friend in unusual places.
29.
Straight Dave | February 8, 2010 at 8:06 pm
Even straight guys have stories. Here’s mine.
I lived in California from 1977-83 and have been obsessively following the various same-sex marriage cases since the SF Mayor tried to jump-start the process several years ago. I now live in Massachusetts and strongly advocated our taking the lead in this country. I was on the Iowa Supreme Court email notification list and heard that news immediately, and even took a day off from work to watch their arguments live on the web.
But I have gone through a long and winding history to get to this point. I grew up in a very religious Protestant family. Church every Sunday was beyond discussion. I was never aware of any homosexuals when I was young, and the common attitude about them was fear and avoidance. I was approached by one in a bus station restroom when I was 20 and almost freaked out. Yes, they were real.
Two years later while I was serving in the Air Force, I was solicited again. This time I was half scared but half curious. I asked the man to sit down and have a conversation about how he had come to select me. He was glad to do so after realizing I wasn’t a threat to him. He thought he would be outed, but I promised him I wouldn’t say a word. That taught me that I could have a rational conversation with these people without feeling threatened.
Five years later I moved to San Francisco and was promoted to manager of a team. One of my former colleagues approached me and said straight out. “I’m gay. do you have any problem with that”? By then, I really didn’t care anymore, and told him that all I expected was that he did his job like everyone else. He was not the only gay person I regularly encountered in SF.
Eventually, Bill and I went on a 2-day backpacking trip up in the high Sierra mountains – wandering around in the wilderness, sightseeing, getting a lot of fresh air and exercise, camping under the stars. We appreciated the great deal we had in common, and totally ignored the minor differences we had, even joking about it. I was married to a woman at the time (and still am after 33 years). She was fully aware of Bill’s orientation and our relationship, and had met him on numerous occasions. After moving to MA, I got a letter from his brother that he had died. I was really really really pissed!! He was only in his 30′s and it was the AIDS era. Who knows, but I drew my own conclusions.
Bill’s openness and honesty and comfort with who he was made a huge difference in how I viewed gay people and my ultimate acceptance of them as valid and legitimate human beings.
I remember him every time I hear anyone disparage gays or lesbians, and call them out and let them know how unacceptable and unapproved their actions are. This is my legacy to my dear friend Bill. I will not reinforce or give tacit approval to intolerance, ignorance or injustice, because that is what bigots thrive on.
To my friends on this forum, I encourage you to be open and honest about who you are at every opportunity. Yes, you will be knocked down occasionally by those who have no tolerance. But I believe that there is much more to be gained by soliciting straight allies who need to see you as very normal people with all the same values and concerns and problems and beliefs as they have. The 95% you have in common will be readily recognized and appreciated. I believe that making yourselves visible on a personal and individual level will go a long ways to building the grassroots support you need to overturn Prop H8.
Good luck to all!
30.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 8:20 pm
Thank you, Straight Dave. You represent the type of people I have encountered in most of my dealings. And your support of us, and your calling bigots on their BS and educating them as to the truth about LGBTQQI’s is the best way you can honor Bill’s memory. You will have a special place waiting for you in the great beyond, and only then will you learn how many lives you have touched in a positive way because of your friendship and brotherly love of Bill. You are definitely a man of honor.
31.
Felyx | February 8, 2010 at 8:23 pm
You are part of the majority and not the minority. And that is a compliment!
Thank-you.
Felyx
32.
David Kimble | February 8, 2010 at 8:11 pm
Thank you Richard thank you for sharing your beautiful, but painful story with us. I am happy to see it has a happy ending!
33.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 8:21 pm
Thank you, David Kimble. And after the wedding, the pictures will be on my facebook page. It is the quickest way I can share them with all my friends, who are scattered all over the place.
34.
David Kimble | February 8, 2010 at 8:30 pm
In telling our individual stories, it gives us a sense of family and belonging – I think this great! I also wanted to acknowledge our allies in this campaign, without whose help and numbers, we would have no voice! SO THANK YOU FROM THE BOTTOM OF MY GAY HEART!
Love,
David
35.
Straight Dave | February 8, 2010 at 8:56 pm
Richard W-J: Congrats on your upcoming marriage. I agree with getting that piece of paper in the bank, might come in handy. Not to screw up your marriage plans in CT, but from what I hear you could do it in DC after about Mar 8, if the closeness makes a difference.
36.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 9:08 pm
March 8th? NO way? Same Sex Marriage will be legal in DC on my birthday? Oh, wow. But no, distance is not a factor. My husband (in all but legal standing) is a Lubavitcher Chasidic Rabbi and a family who consider him their ONLY rabbi have asked us to come up so that BZ can do the Jewish wedding for their daughter. She and her husband-to-be are coming in from their duty station in March to take care of the legal ceremony and then return so they can get all the paperwork straightened out to transfer stateside, so we are going to slip over to Danbury, CT from Lititz, PA for our wedding. And if you are on FB, look for me there. And the wedding pictures will be posted within 48 hours of the wedding and all the other festivities. Thank you for the information though.
37.
Cassie | February 8, 2010 at 9:32 pm
I’m kind of a lurker on this site (more like a stalker…I’ve been checking it multiple times a day since the trial started) and decided to share my story…
I’m 17, and I’ve been raised mormon my whole life. I’ll spare the details, but spophomore year I realized that I liked girls in addition to, at the time, boys. I started cutting my wrists and scratching any part of my body to bleed and feel pain and control it because I couldn’t control my emotions. During all this, I was dating a boy, that added to my hatred of myself.
I’ve been taught my whole life that liking members of the same sex is wrong. My mom told my sister and I when I was in 3rd grade that my aunt is a lesbian, tho she’d known since before either of us was born. She told us not to dislike our auntie for it, and to not talk about it to any of our friends. This shows the depth of my mom’s hatred for gays and lesbians.
Anyway, ithe boy broke up with me, and friends got me to stop hurting myself for a while. Some of my friends were also bisexual, so that helped me realize it’s okay. I started dating one of my other friends, a girl. I had met someone on postsecret and we became fast friends. We emailed like crazy, mostly on the topic of being bi. Long story short, my parents rifled thru my email and found out about my not so straight sexuality.
They confronted be the night before Halloween of 2008. They wouldn’t even let me go to my room to cry alone. I ran out of the house bawling, but they followed me in both cars. The next day I was taken out of school and to a Mormon shrink…in my costume…hah.
The next year was hell for me. (My home life still is hell, but a little less firey.) My parents called me names, told me how much I was (am) hurting them, took away all of my privileges (including my cell phone and all communication outside of school…tho they considered taking me out of that too…and moving to Utah.), and sent me to the shrink every week.
Not much has changed since that night before Halloween. I cry less, I no longer hurt myself (17 months strong), and things aren’t as explosive at home. But my parents still hate me, still shoot me dirty looks, make rude comments about “gays and their lifestyle”, try to take me away from my friends.
And how being mormon plays into this…I am forced to go to church every sunday, seminary every morning, and mutual every tuesday. (If you dnt know what those are, ask and I’ll explain.) I went thru all of this at the height of prop 8. (All of this meaning my hatred of myself and figuring things out and my parents finding out.) The church spewed all sorts of hate EVERYWHERE. Church, seminary, mutual…I couldn’t get away from it. Boys chanted “be straight, yes on 8!” And teachers smiled at them. There’s so much more to the story, but this is way too long and I’m really tired.
To all of you out there who are struggling, like me, live one day at a time. You don’t think time will pass, but it will! And to those whose parents supported them when they came out, I’m so jealous. I hope you know how lucky you are. I didn’t even get to come out to my parents…
Love,
Cassie
38.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 8, 2010 at 9:54 pm
Stay strong, Cassie. If I can make it through, so can you. And now we have this wonderful community that both of us have found here at the Trial tracker. Promise us all that you will not give up on yourself. You have survived too much already, so there is no doubt that you are a strong young lady. Keep on going. You will make it. And you will be stronger for it, and you will be better able to hlp sme other LGBTQQI teen who comes to you later asking how you made it through.
39.
Sheryl | February 8, 2010 at 10:05 pm
cassie, I’m so sorry that you have not had support from your parents. Obviously, they think that homosexuality (or bi-sexuality) is a choice and not a genetic happening. How anyone can think that people choose to live a life that will have them ridiculed, hurt, and, in some cases, ostracized from their family and friends, or even to commit suicide is beyond me. But then I’m pretty liberal anyway (especially for a Mormon). I would bet you are not the only one in your ward. And what the youth and children (youth age 12 and up in Mormon terminology) had to go thru during the Prop 8 campaign should not have happened. We had one stake speaker that laid all of the ills of the world at the door of homosexuals. Lets teach hate from the pulpit, great. Don’t know how that fits into the golden rule the “let he who has not sinned throw the first stone.”
I’m glad you are here Cassie and you will lots of undestanding friends here.
sheryl, a liberal mormon with a gay son who is the light of her life.
40.
Felyx | February 8, 2010 at 10:06 pm
Cassie, at 18 you are a free man….(actually you have a lot more legal liberty right now of which you may not be aware.) In any event there are those who would provide you with care and support if you ever wish to leave your circumstances. If you feel that it would be a wise decision to move and if you are not able to find long-term caring support anywhere else that you are comfortable with then my email is above. My family concerns itself with ‘rescue’ of gay men of any age that are in need.
Whatever you do, just know that there are those who care and who will provide for you for no other reason than because you are loved.
Sincerely,
Felyx
Post Scriptus: This is a small but real group of gay men…do not make inquiries unless you are sincere. Those under the age of 18 WILL be assisted in conjuction with ligitimate social service until they reach the age of independent consent.
41.
Felyx | February 8, 2010 at 10:10 pm
Well, I am embarrassed! Sorry Cassie. I will ammend, at 18 you are a free woman. I apologize for any insult.
The assistance is open to any in the LGBT community, there is all female housing available.
42.
David Kimble | February 9, 2010 at 1:33 am
Hello Cassie, I know what you mean, because I too was raised Mormon – I don’t know, if you are interested in writing, but I have found, at least that my writing gives me an outlet for my frustrations. I am 56 years old now. I just wanted you to know, you are never alone and I don’t mean that “God is always with you” – commonly taught in the Mormon faith. What this site has done for our community is to recognize we are never alone – we are strong and we will carry-on! Thank you for having the “courage” in the face of fire (I think you will understand what I mean by this last statement.)
Love,
David
43.
Gregory in Salt Lake City | February 9, 2010 at 9:14 am
Thank you for sharing your story Cassie. I forwarded it to two other persons as further illustration how well meaning persons in the Mormon/LDS church can hurt and devastate their own families by supporting prop 8 and other anti LGBT activities. Bless you dear Cassie. Best of all to you!
44.
rpx | February 9, 2010 at 1:42 pm
Cassie, not every family is like your family. I’m somewhere over age 50 and both my son and daughter are gay. It was a couple days shock for me but then I got over it and accepted and support my children for who they are. Actually thye never changed who they were, the only difference is now my husband and I knew. We then ogt on the phone and called all our relatives adn told them our kids were gay. We were not going to be ashamed of them and wanted this out int he open. I truly believe that psychological harm occurs by being in the closet.
Both our children have wonderful partners in life, and we have had big weddings for both of them, although not recognized by the state. My daughters partner used a fertility clinic and an anonymos sperm donor and delivered us twin grandchildren, a boy and a girl. There are many many families who are not like yours, each of our children’s partners family is just like we are.
I suggest you immerse yourself in your studies, study like heck and then pick a college at least 4 states away. If you are 4 states away your parents will never surprise visit you. In college you will find acceptence and love. You will gain your self worth and reputation back once you go to college. Don’t ever deny who you are. Stay true to yourself. Doesn’t mean you have to be confontational, but you can be quietly determined and when confronted never deny. There is a whole WORLD of acceptance outside of where you live now, you just gotta go find it and college is your best shot at it. Remember not all familes are like your family, they are not. Good LUCK CASSIE!!!!!!!
45.
geekgirl | February 10, 2010 at 3:32 pm
Cassie,
When I was 17, I was a high school student in a small mid-western blue collar town. I was so afraid of the feelings I was having. I had crushes on girls and I had some idea that it meant I was a lesbian, but I heard the things other kids said about lezzies and faggots, so I kept it all inside. I was so afraid of being different.
I went through a period in college where I got involved in a religious group…I guess I just wanted to belong somewhere, anywhere. They were really nice people, and they were my friends, but some of their teachings said it was wrong to be gay and that I could be “healed”. I believed it, and I tried…I tried to change. I wanted to change because I didn’t want to be different. I prayed and prayed, but I was still me, still gay. All it led to was an emotional breakdown after college. I could no longer try to be someone I wasn’t, and I began the long journey of coming out, healing and becoming comfortable with myself.
When I was 17, I thought I would never be happy. I thought I was the only person like me and I’d never find anyone to love me. Now that I’m older, I have found lots of like-minded people and I have learned to let go of the shame and self-hatred that our society can make us feel.
I can’t make it better for you, but I can tell you this. Don’t worry so much about what people think of you now. You don’t know it now, but someday you’ll meet the love of your life and it will all make sense, and all the suffering will have made you a better person, more capable of compassion and understanding. A better human being.
I wish you the best.
46.
wodenponey | February 8, 2010 at 9:41 pm
Thanks everyone for sharing their stories. Very insightful to read.
Peace and love!
47.
Ed | February 8, 2010 at 9:51 pm
Cassie,
Thank you for your story. Maybe you can go away from today knowing that there are even more people on your side and in your corner than you ever realized. Your courage in telling your story here is incredible- almost as incredible as the courage that it takes for you to live every day, loving yourself, knowing that you are one day closer to independence, to living where you can be yourself, each day. I feel as though I have been priviliged to hear the beginning of a long and remarkable story which will only grow stronger and deeper with the growing strength and maturity of the narrator. Thank you-
Ed
Ed
48.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 12:44 am
“When did I choose to be Gay” by Ronnie Mc
Sup!?……I’m Ronnie Mc and I am a 25 yo African/American/Irish/Dutch/Canadian/French Gay Boy whose family has been in America for seven gens since right after the signing of the D.O.I and whose fathers family…well we all know that African people didn’t really have a choice back them now did they? Now I would ask anybody (but specifically the Bigots) a simple Q:
When did I choose to be gay? Was it the day that I was born, June 27th 1984 at 9:30PM in Paterson New Jersey? The same day that I almost died?The same day that my mother almost died? Was it when my mother left me with friends the first six months of my life because she had to live out of motels? Why did she do that, you might ask. Well, my father use to beat her, When he was angry at her he would stuff her into a closet the size of a refrigerator. One night she was done and did not want her youngest son to grow up with this type of man. She took me, his credit cards, and nothing but the clothes on our backs and left him. When did I choose to be Gay?
Was it when she let him back into my life, when she realized he had changed? She did it because he now had a wife and wanted no kids to take home but wanted to know his son in blood only. Was it when he shaved off all my curly blonde hair because he thought I looked like a white girl? Was it when I was two and my mother threw out my baby bottle? Was it when her best friend’s mother who I called Grandma Carmela or Aubuela gave me a new bottle and always filled it with light and sweet coffee? Was it when my fathers mother gave me my first doll, a My Buddy I called Buddy, was it then? When did I choose to be Gay?
Was it when I was five and my step mother hated my mother so much that she bent down and said, “I’m going to burn your house down with you and your mother in it”, could that have been it? Was it when I was seven and lost my aunt to breast Cancer one year after going to Disney in Florida with her for the first time? Or was it one year later on the exact same day when my favorite uncle died due to HIV/AIDS complications, just 20 feet from me? I was eight and could not say goodbye because of hospital policy. I was to young. Was it then? When did I choose to be Gay?
Was it at ten when I was old enough to know the following: I had on older brother and sister from a different father, I had an older sister from the same mother and father. Basically my father said that she wasn’t his and my mother could not take care of her. My mother hasn’t seen her in 30 years other then a picture my cousin stole because they went to the same high school. Was it when I had to fight with my three younger brothers for my fathers attention from when I was 13 to 16 years old? Was it when I had enough of my step mother’s threats at 16 and slapped her so hard my father finally snapped? Was it at 13 when I kissed a boy, but thought I was only playing house? or was it at 11 when my other aunt said playing with toy baby bottles makes you a girl? Was it when I fracture my right wrist in the fourth grade and fell behind because I couldn’t use my right hand? Or in the First Grade when I had the Chicken Pockets? Or maybe in that same year I had to move and leave all my friends? Was it it second grade when I saw an 8th grade girl get shot by her boyfriend in front of the corner store on the way to school? When did I choose to be gay?
Was it in the eighth grade when my first girlfriend broke up with me because I was getting “too serious”? Was it freshmen year of high school when I had my first crush on a boy on the same track team as me? Was it that same year when I drank a whole bottle of nyquil hoping that I would die because kids called me names like “Faggot” and “Homo” when I wasn’t even 100% sure I was gay? Was it at 15 when my mother finally decided to let me know that before I was born my father forced her to have an abortion? Was it when I quit Boy Scouts and my racists Scout Master called me black boy when I got braids for a very short 3 months? Was it sophomore year when I tried to kill me self by swallowing a whole bottle of anti-depressents because I thought maybe I was bisexual? Or was it that same year when kids said I would shoot up the school like columbine even though I was nothing like those kids? Was it when the harassment got so bad I tried to smother myself with a pillow and my mother had to fight the pillow of off my face? In that moment I said I think I’m gay, but only to myself. Was it that summer when I pushed away my only male friend because I thought he was Gay and I started to date our friend while flaunting it in his face? Or was it Junior year when all of sudden I gained self confidence and became one of the most popular kids in school over night? Was it when a friend lost her father in 9-11 as well as when I was waiting with my fav. teacher trying to get in touch with his father who was supposed to be in the buildings or when I was waiting to hear from my mother about our friend and her co-workers son who both survived but worked in the Twin Towers? Was it 2 moths into Junior year, when I broke up with my girlfriend because she wanted to have sex? Was it when that ex-friend came out of the closet, but not to me? Was it that spring when I finally proved to my track coach that I was just as good as our top sprinter? Was it that year when I took boxing lessons? Was it at the end of that school year when my friends convinced me to go out for the cheerleading squad and they said they needed me to become stars? When did I choose to be Gay?
Was it the summer before senior year at cheer camp when my best friend on the squad told that the reason my first girlfriend, all the way back in eight grade, broke up with me was because she herself was a lesbian? That would have been a good time to say, “so I’m Gay too”, but no instead I said,”really?”. Was it Senior year when I asked a freshmen girl to be my girlfriend? I mean hear I was, Track star, cheer god, popular, good dancer, Abercrombie boy, artist. She was putty in my hands. I made out with her in the hallways and held her hand but when it came to heavy making out and touching, I couldn’t do it. I broke up with her before Thanksgiving. How about this; was it when I asked my best friend to go out and 2 weeks later she broke up with me? She said it was her father, but he liked me..so I don’t think it was that and now our friendship was awkward until we graduated and went our separate ways. Was it four months within graduation when one kid said, “If you F-ing look at my Faggot. I’ll slash your throat.” He was expelled, that was almost 7 years ago and now works at a gas station. Was it at 18 when I finally told my father I never wanted to see him again go have fun with your slut of a wife, and daemon spawn boys and enjoy your miserable worthless life. A a year later he tried to kill himself, his wife, and kids by ramming the van into a tree. Then a year later he tried to get in contact with me and I told my mother I didn’t want to see him…he had a heart attack but didn’t die..shucks….Was it when that aunt that called me a girl for playing with dolls came out as a Lesbian, met a woman online and moved to Albany, NY?…She paid for that one!…..When did I choose to be Gay?
Was it freshmen year of college when I got my first job at Rubey Tuesdays filled with Gay waiters, a fact I didn’t know when I applied and accepted the job. Was it at the end of that first week, when another girl who was new was giving me a ride to Fridays where we were all meeting for drinks, well she asked, “Ronnie do you have a boyfriend?” I said nothing and then she said, “Well, that answers my next Q.” All of a sudden I had Gay friends, I was going to clubs in NYC, I actually started kissing and dancing with boys willingly and knowingly. I went to my first Gay Pride in NYC on my 20th birthday. Was it a year later when my closeted English Prof. who was also a Reverend, tried to stonewall me from passing his class and I got expelled from school? I was so in shocked I had a cardiac event in which my blood pressure was that of an 84yo…but turns out I was mildly bi-polar. Was it when they asked me to comeback because I was getting noticed for a photo shoot I did on their campus with my fashions and I said shove your degree up your @$$? Was it when I got accepted to the Art Institute of NYC for Fashion Design and was told I’m a natural at everything? When did I choose to be gay?
Was it when I brought my older Bisexual half sister to her first big city Gay club in NYC when I was 20 and she convinced my to get on the stage and then was offered a job? Not as a go-go boy, but as a Gay College Party Dancer. Then soon I was working at several clubs and marching/dancing in the Gay pride Parade. Was it when I quit working for Godiva my first quarter at AINY to work for Abercrombie and Fitch? Was it when I was 22 and I landed my first real boyfriend and lost my virginity only to break up 2 months later? Was it when I produced my first Fashion show raising a $800 each for the Hyacinth AIDS Foundation and American Cancer Society? Was it when I was walking to the bus terminal at 4am in NYC and some guy yelled “Faggot” then I said “whatever dude”, then he turns around to come after me and gets hit by a car dead on?…Karma Sucks!…Was it when I was 23 and again I was walking to the bus terminal and some guy tried to bash me? But what he didn’t know was that I was a boxer in high school and long story short he’s the one that wound up in the hospital.Was it at the senior fashion show when I was 1 of 15 designers chosen out of 100 to show their three look collection? When did I choose to be Gay?
Was it when I moved to Philly to get my BA and live on my own for 2 years? I was so intrenched in my designs I had next to no social life, no job, and only one Homosexual sexual encounter with a guy that went nowhere because surprise surprise,,,We’re both bottoms!…But we are good internet pals now, because he lives in Philly and i’m back home in NJ. Was it when My oldest cat that I had for 16 years died the second to last week of my final class last June…just weeks before my 25th birthday? Was it at the final review where I was praised for my skills in making good fitting mens and women’s jeans? Was it at the end of my internship, when they said that they love my work but they can’t afford to higher me? When did I choose to be Gay?
Was it every other day of my life when I hear from some family member, every family member…. I love you and I support you…who cares if you’re Gay… ranging from 6yo – 64yo from family members who are Doctors, Marines, Psychiatrists, teachers, bar tenders, retired, Christian, Catholic, Jehovah Witness, Gay, Straight and Bi( I told you homosexuality runs in my family, nobody adopted all blood)….was that when?
If being Gay is a choice, which you Bigots seem to think you know, but you have no idea unless you are Gay yourself?……So please do tell me where in the evolution of “MY” life do you “think” I choose to be Gay?
49.
PDXAndrew | February 9, 2010 at 8:35 am
Awesome way to ask the question. Thanks!
From my experience, when you ask then “exactly when did you choose to be straight?” you get a very funny confused look. Their mouths move like fish before they always say “I’ve always been straight.”
EXACTLY!
50.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 10:47 am
You are welcome PDXAndrew, I thought it was perfect for that very reason…They think they know but they have no idea….lol
51.
Alan E. | February 9, 2010 at 10:02 am
I really enjoyed reading this, and my story almost pales in comparison. I didn’t enjoy it because of the pain and trauma, but for the honesty and self-awareness you have. It takes a lot to be able to reflect on your life and recognize the things and events that weren’t caused by you, but others around you. I too was on the track team and had crushes on other runners, but I was deathly afraid of coming out to the point of self-denial. Thank you for your unique story.
52.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 10:53 am
You are totally welcome too Alan E…..I don’t think the people who want to deny us all the rights we deserve as Tax paying American’s know what we really go through…The thing is for most people the name calling, discrimination, and threats stop at high school but for LGBT people it never stops…not on our death beads and not even after we’re dead…That will never end just like it still goes on for racial minorities but at least soon we will have all the protections and rights that they do.
53.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 9, 2010 at 9:15 pm
All I can say after reading this, Ronnie, is YOU GO, BOY!
54.
David Kimble | February 9, 2010 at 1:55 am
Wow! Thank you Ronnie – most of the people on the other side of the rainbow (that’s what I have decided to call the straight world) have not got a clue what our lives are like or the damage they inflict upon us on a daily basis. Thank you for sharing – I am sitting here – it is nearly 1:50a in California, where I am – tears are running down my cheeks. The tears are for you,
Ronny, and all of us, where ever we may be, who struggle with the things the straight world doesn’t want to understand. Unless they can cross over the rainbow to our side of the world, they will never understand. Still, as I have said in previous posts at this website, telling our stories gives us a sense of community and they can never take our stories or our community away from us! BTW, I don’t believe any of us chose to be gay – I know I certainly didn’t.
Love,
David
55.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 7:25 am
You’re welcome, David K…..It took me an hour to write that….I had to remember things that I tried to block out…but we know they never go away…much like a certain somethings somethings and a new one I might add….anywho…Those are the things that made me who I am….If the Bigots actually had a heart they would be able to read these instead of posting lies about themselves to instigate a reaction or worse drive some kid to kill himself/herself….you are good people too
<3
56.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 6:14 am
Dear Friends:
Thank you so much for sharing your stories. Your courage humbles me beyond belief. I am so honored that you have accepted me into your community.
Cassie, I can only echo what others have said. There are people who love you and care, even if they are not the ones in your home. Please consider accepting Felyx’s offer of assistance.
Love from your straight ally,
Fiona
57.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 6:59 am
Thank you Fiona64 aka Dopty-Mom….It appears we have a new troll that is worse and yet the words are exactly the same….Hmmm?
58.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 7:02 am
And P.S. of course you are welcome and accepted…You’re good people..xoxo
59.
MikeB | February 9, 2010 at 6:31 am
Here’s my story:
I was brought up in a very traditional environment: married parents, bros and sisses, nice house in the ‘burbs; call it Leave it to Beaver.
I didn’t have much exposure to homosexuality growing up; we were all straight, and that was that. I was totally straight, as far as I knew, until I went to college and met some very nice guys; some of the nicest guys I ever met. Turns out these guys were gay, and they taught me how to be tolerant, and even convinced me to physically experiment with them.
Ultimately, I’ve come to accept the fact that while I still consider myself straight, I am sexually attracted to men. In between girlfiends, I’ve had a few sexual encounters with guys; some of the nicest guys I ever met. And I now have Herpes, HPV, and a case of gonnorhea, because these nicest guys I ever met were sex-crazed idiots who were having bareback sex while stupid me was insisting on condoms.
I hate the fact that I have this attraction to guys; fortunately, it comes and goes. My experience with homosexual men is that they are sexually obsessed, willing to risk their lives for a new physical high. They snort (I don’t know what it is) before sex, they shove objects in their orifices that are too big to fit; it’s really rather disturbing.
This is my experience. I think the gay/lesbian movement is presenting a lie about homosexual behavior in order to achieve rights. But, it seems, that the public knows that it is a lie, and, hopefully, even if marriage rights are granted, adoption rights will be denied. Kids should not be exposed to the kind of behavior exhibited by homosexuals; it teaches them about sexual behaviors they might never have been exposed to, and the only good thing that can come of it is disease. AIDS is still a gay disease, and I know why.
60.
Straight Ally #3008 | February 9, 2010 at 6:36 am
Obvious troll is obvious. Ignore him, folks.
61.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 6:44 am
Troll Alert….Bigot at the Helms….Bloggin Boglin…..Prop Ha8te False Propaganda
62.
MikeB | February 9, 2010 at 7:09 am
As long as the word “troll” does not imply “liar,” I’m good with the monicker. You’re all stroking yourselves while denying the facts. Take off the rose-colored glasses, friends, and admit what you all know is the truth.
63.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 8:13 am
Hmm. Seems to me that if any of MikeB’s story was true, he would know that gonorrhea can be cured by a course of antibiotics … and that the largest (and growing) group of HIV/AIDS patients is heterosexual women of color. http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/topics/women/resources/factsheets/pdf/women.pdf
This straight ally thinks MikeB is full of it. Extra points for creative writing, though.
Love,
Fiona
64.
JonT | February 9, 2010 at 12:02 pm
You first. :)
65.
Felyx | February 9, 2010 at 7:31 am
I would have to take MikeB somewhat seriously. Clearly he has been hurt by the experiences he was seeking out but he acknowledges that sexuality is a trait within him that doesn’t change and with which he had to deal.
“I hate the fact that I have this attraction to guys; fortunately, it comes and goes.”
Many men are taught to be self-hating and have similar crises of character. They hate themselves for being gay then go out and have uncontrolled self destructive sexual encounters. If they had known that they were normal and accepted they would be more likely to seek out stable loving partners that do not engage in high risk behaviours like the ones Mike was into.
I would not disparage Mike as he clearly states, “while I still consider myself straight, I am sexually attracted to men.”
It is not meet to derrogate someone as sexually confused and angry as Mike. He needs love and proper first hand education about gay life, not rumor innuendo and prejudice of the kind he was taught in his youth.
There are some many like Mike and I can only hope that he will not lie by ommision by not telling his female partners of his sexual desires. It is unfortunate that must suffer but to be with a woman and lie and possibly have a child, well that would be dangerous and unfair to those that would trust him. I hope you will get counselling Mike before potentially hurting a future partner. You need to be honest with these women (and the men) about your sexuality or you will never have a marriage based on trust and honesty. I feel for you Mike and I can only hope that you will seek professional help before any more individuals get hurt.
66.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 8:17 am
You know what Fekyx, you are so right…..I am so sorry MikeB for making such a broad generalization about you. You know for mentioning things that the heterosexual sexual world are a thousand times more guilty of? But so did you, read the statement bio about me, I am Gay and I am none or practice any of things you suggested… I don’t have any STDS(I get tested once a month)…I’m not promiscuous…the last time I had sex was a year ago, so therefor I can not be sex crazed…an Idiot implies that I have no education and I am mentally handicapped but no i’m not and Ihave 2 degrees..also how do you know you didn’t get any STDs from those girlfriends? You know straight women have them too? And excuse me for saying this…but I don’t snort……
If you read the trial tanscripts it was proven in court the prop ha8te are the liars….and if adoptions are not made legal which they are…there is still in-vitro/surrogate which is not illegal for same sex couples to do.
Oh and there are straight people who support LGBT rights as well so i guess they must be lying also.
I don’t know how old you are, because you didn’t mention anything about who you are and what forms of discrimination because you are Gay/Bi that you have had to deal with..The title of this thread is courageous stories and yours seems like a cry for help…. I am only 25 and only can speak for myself not all LGBT people like you have…I don’t have rose colored glasses, crystal covered sun glasses yes, but they are black not rose…again I am sorry for calling you those names but I would really appreciate it of you apologize for insulting me as a Gay man who is none of the things you implied…I hope one day you find the man or woman you want to marry and can do so because that is what we all want. Oh and there are straight people who support LGBT rights as well so i guess they must be lying also.
<3……Ronnie Mc.
67.
Dave T | February 9, 2010 at 7:44 am
George! You’ve changed your name!
68.
Andrew | February 9, 2010 at 7:57 am
I agree with Felyx… Mike – I do hope that you do talk to a professional. In my experiences, I have met quite a few men just like you and while there is quite a bit of hostility in you regarding your feelings, it would ultimately be best to work this out with someone qualified.
There are decent and good gay people out there. Just like any demographic, there is good and bad.
My hope is that some day, you will actually meet and accept them as friends regardless of your comments.
69.
Kevin_BGFH | February 9, 2010 at 9:22 am
Closets are dark, stifling places. I’m sorry your experiences weren’t very positive. Sadly, that sometimes happens when someone’s only experiences with the gay community are strictly for occasional sexual purposes. It sounds like the reason you may be meeting “sex-crazed idiots” is because your only exposure to the community was when you were looking for sex. If you have an opportunity to meet and become friends with LGBT people — real friends, not sex buddies — you may find a lot more dimensions to the community that you haven’t seen before. It’s like the blind man encountering the elephant — if he just touches a leg and assumes it’s a tree trunk without exploring more, he’s not getting the full picture.
I’m 42 years old. I’ve been out since I was 18. I have never had any sort of STD ever in my life. I have a very large, warm, nurturing circle of friends, none of whom I’ve ever had sex with (I’m on friendly terms with all of my ex’s, but my closest friendships have always been strictly platonic). And many of my friends have been close friends for over 20 years. There are quite a lot of people out there who aren’t “sex-crazed idiots” doing drugs and all sorts of other stuff. But they’re less likely to be frequenting the places one goes when one is looking for sex. I hope you have an opportunity to meet more people like my friends someday. It will help you see that there’s a whole lot more to the gay community than what you’ve had a chance to see.
70.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 9:35 am
I’m still torn as to whether I believe that Mike is telling the truth … it all seems a little “convenient,” with his summation at the end.
On the other hand, I can also see (after reading Andrew’s, Felyx’ and your remarks) that this could indeed be a case of horrible, horrible self-loathing that sort of proves the whole point of the Prop 8 trial. Being gay is so socially stigmatized that Mike can’t even admit to himself that he is *at a minimum* bisexual. I am hopeful that Mike will seek counseling, whether it is to learn to accept his own sexuality or to find out why he feels the need to lash out at people different from himself.
Love,
Fiona
71.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 9:36 am
PS – Ronnie, I’m sorry I forgot to mention you in my list. I read your comments as well.
Love from your ‘dopty-Mom,
Fiona
72.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 11:01 am
It’s all good…… <3
73.
JonT | February 9, 2010 at 12:13 pm
Kevin_BGFH – you took the words right out of my mouth.
If he is as ashamed of his man-desires as he claims, then the only places for him to go would probably be parks, seedy bars, and other ‘casual hook-up’ places, full of people just like him – ashamed, drugged, horny, and a higher probability of being a bio-hazard.
Welcome to the closet Mike – I hope you will eventually find your way out of it.
74.
Gregory in Salt Lake City | February 9, 2010 at 9:54 am
Mike – I can certainly accept your comments as valid for you and representative of your experiences. I can also see how based on your experiences you can interpret and draw conclusions. I experimented in the world you described in the ’80′s and know it certainly exists. I would suggest to you however, that what you experienced does not represent all gay persons and many “straight” persons engage in extreme behaviors too. I invite you to search beyond your experiences and you may find stories and lives of LGBT persons who do no fit the stereotypes you present. I wish you well on your life journey. Sorry for your afflictions.
75.
Gregory in Salt Lake City | February 9, 2010 at 11:16 am
MikeB (sorry about redunant post…still getting used to this website, wanted to reply to correct person)
I can certainly accept your comments as valid for you and representative of your experiences. I can also see how based on your experiences you can interpret and draw conclusions. I experimented in the world you described in the ’80’s and know it certainly exists. I would suggest to you however, that what you experienced does not represent all gay persons and many “straight” persons engage in extreme behaviors too. I invite you to search beyond your experiences and you may find stories and lives of LGBT persons who do no fit the stereotypes you present. I wish you well on your life journey. Sorry for your afflictions.
76.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 7:35 am
The de-ga-ga is……….. jislaaik! kak, kiff, mal, mamparra, moegoe…las mompie! Ou Mos and I am not nogal, rooinek. All you do is skop, sket en donner, sies.
Oh ok
77.
Ben in Texas | February 9, 2010 at 7:48 am
Here is my story. I am 25 soon to be 26 at the end of the month. I grew up in a small town in Central Texas. My family was very religious and we always went to church every Sunday. For thirteen years of my life I attended a private christian school. I was the middle child two older sisters and a younger brother. I was the chameleon of the family always trying to avoid trouble and the loner. I knew from a very young age that I liked guys. I liked to be around them and I liked the way they looked; however being made fun of as a sissy made me realize that I could not tell anyone.
One summer when I was in going into 7th grade I was in a community musical, The Music Man, and I played Winthrop the boy with a lisp. Upon returning to school I mentioned that is what I did for part of my summer and received a lot of strange looks and some comments, driving me further into self loathing. High School was torturous and I hated everyday, I was picked on incessantly. I was told repeatedly that gays were immoral, they were damned to hell, and should be killed. By that time I knew what gay was and I knew if I came out I would be immediately kicked out of school because the school hand book said so. I thought I might be kicked out of my home. I knew no one who would take me in. I would be homeless. Upon graduating High School I knew college was the place to recreate my life so I began coming out slowly to friends. I came out on Facebook those high school friends that I considered friends stopped talking to me.
In September 2004, the semester I was going to come out to my family my father was diagnosed with terminal kidney cancer. He passed away on December 14 that year the last day of finals at the college I was attending. My biggest regret was I never let my father truly get to know me, I held him at arms length because I was afraid.
The summer after, I came out to my siblings and then my mother a few months later. Their acceptance was less than stellar and still they are not really supportive. I moved to Austin, Tx since then and have built a network of friends who have become my family. I am politically active here because I am fighting for the kids in the small towns like I grew up who had no gay men and women to look up to. Who feel alone and trapped.
78.
rpx | February 9, 2010 at 2:09 pm
I hope you can stay close to your family. Don’t give up on them. I enjoyed reading your story.
79.
Gregory in Salt Lake City | February 9, 2010 at 8:15 am
I started a Blog but havn’t persisted. your stories inspire me to dedicate time and energy to tell my story and reach out to family member to make a difference…even one person at a time. Starting today and every day I will begin adding to my Blog, here is an excerpt:
“I grew up in a small Utah Mormon town. I went on a mission and married my high school sweetheart in the Salt Lake Temple. This path was determined for me from the day I was born into a straight LDS family…I never considered anything else; I didn’t know other options existed. Over the years I’ve held many church callings including High Council member (a short-lived but lovely experience). I aspired to be in the Mormon Tabernacle Choir. I’m also a homosexual man who struggled many years to “overcome” my homosexuality by attending Evergreen, LDS social services, other counseling, prayer, study…I really thought I was on the right path and published my thoughts in the LDS Ensign magazine, January 1997, “Becoming Whole Again.” 12 years later I am still not “cured”.
I have finally done what many have suggested, embrace who I am. Now divorced, ex-communicated and sharing a life with my dear partner of two years I feel blessed and more “Whole” than any point of my life. This Fantastic Journey amazes and delights me at every turn! I see life, love, religion, fatherhood, politics, music…everything through new eyes.”
Love and light to all!
80.
Santa Barbara Mom | February 9, 2010 at 9:50 am
Dear Gregory, thank you so much for sharing. I am an active member of the church in SB. I will save your blog in the event anyone would ever suggest to me that being gay is a choice.
I just spent a spendid week-end in San Francisco with my youngest son. When I am there, I am immersed in the gay community. Friday he invited me to join him at his favorite dance club………I was one of about 4 women among 200 men! We had a good time……..he is so special to me:) I would love for you to write another article for the Ensign.
I am so glad that religion is still a part of your life, and I hope one day my son will feel that way again. He is only 22. We know that Heavenly Father loves ALL his children and wants them ALL to find joy in this earthly life.
Thank you again for being who you are.
Love,
Julie
81.
Gregory in Salt Lake City | February 9, 2010 at 10:12 am
Thank you for your comments Santa Barbar Mom :) Bless you for supporting your son. My parents have never waivered in their love and support to me and that is a blessing I never take for granted! These discussions have prompted me to get busy blogging!
About religion, I’m not sure where I stand on this. Acceptance of my self has caused me to re-examine my beliefs on everything! I do believe in the goodness of people and you remind me of the beautiful, yet simple teaching of Jesus: “Love One Another”
82.
Santa Barbara Mom | February 9, 2010 at 10:37 am
That is the greatest commandment “Love One Another”. I am chorister for our ward, so am in the forefront every week. I cry a lot over the impact Prop 8 had on my family. I try to stay focused on my relationship with Heavenly Father and his great love for all his children. He knows our struggles and our pain, and sexual orientation will not determine our fate (in my belief). I would so like to read your “blog” when it’s completed. Will you tell me where I can find it or even send me a copy? Actually, I am good friends with our new Stake Pres and I think your story would greatly help him in counseling parents, etc.
83.
Gregory in Salt Lake City | February 9, 2010 at 11:02 am
Dear Santa Barbara Mom -
Your comments took me by surprise about chorister brought and ache and lump in my throat and stomach how I miss that. I was involved in the music every which way at the Ward and Stake levels until I left the church. The church missing out on my talent, training and good heart by not allowing me to still help with music. A quick story, my current Bishop needed an organist so invited me to participate, I asked him to investigate and he found out that was not proper and he was dismayed that he couldn’t use my willing help. Come to find out he has a gay son working on a P.H.D. at the University of Utah and seems knowing me helped heal his heart and teach him it’s ok to love and support his Gay son despite Elder Oaks suggestion to not allow your child’s partner to visits or be seen in public as might be construed as support for his/her behavior. My blog has just begun, I’ll get busy! You have helped give me the impetus I need to get writing. Give me a few weeks to document many things Just click on mine name to link to blogspot site. Hugs!
84.
David Kimble | February 9, 2010 at 2:38 pm
Thank you, Gregory for sharing your story with us. I, too, was raised and indoctrinated in the Mormon Church from the age of 7, but my family and Church experiences echo a similar eerie sameness. I, too, completed a two year misssion for the Church, yet I never felt compelled to get married to any of the girls in the Church. For me, there was never any atrraction to the girls in Church, though I did date one of them before going on my 2 year mission to the Deaf Mission of Southern California (as an aside, I was convinced at the time that God must have known I was gay, I mean why else send me to a mission, where the boys would go without their shirts for many of the year! Still, during my mission, while I was tempted, I did not falter, it was only after returning home and moving to the Tri-Cities in Washington State did I realize I was not alone in my feelings. It can be a revelation to learn we are not alone. Our sense of community and values is really little different than the heterosexual community – allow me to explain this a little…what I mean about community is becoming immersed in the coming to terms with who we are and accepting this as fact. It is rather sad, when I think of those individuals, who have never allowed themselves to come to terms with who they are. We have the same desire as any heterosexual person in the world, except that at least some in the Christian world have labeled us, “evil”.
What I find intriguing about the Church is their doctrine is definitely not “gay-friendly”, yet many of us come from that religion.
My best to you and your partner…
Love,
David
85.
Cassie | February 9, 2010 at 8:38 am
Gregory in Salt Lake…ironic… My parents told my bishop about me and he demanded that we talk…many times. I never told him anything, but tried to make him think I had opened up. He gave me some articles about Mormons and homosexuality. He gave me your article. Hate to say it, but I only read a few sentences of every article before I threw them away. Haha. I’m so glad that you’re happy. Good luck to you and your partner…you’re amazing.
Love,
Cassie
86.
Gregory in Salt Lake City | February 9, 2010 at 8:55 am
Dear Cassie…. I’m sorry if my article caused you affliction in any way. I’m working on a way to make amends for my ignorance….more from my blog:
“when I wrote that article for the Ensign magazine (for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints), I had the hope that my story would help others struggling with same-gender attraction. I received feedback of all sorts from “will you please help me cure my son…”, “you inspire me to not give up hope…” to Affirmation website for Gay & Lesbian Mormons calling my article a travesty http://www.affirmation.org/news/1997_03.shtml
As I re-read this article from 1997 I see it through new eyes…I can understand why some would call it a travesty, however, I will save my critical analysis for another day. I would like to apologize for any negative results caused from my article and if the Church would allow it, I would publish a modified/updated article with my current beliefs and values.
87.
Gregory in Salt Lake City | February 9, 2010 at 9:23 am
To Cassie and others affected by Mormon support of Prop 8 are you familiar with this? http://www.mormonproposition.com/
also for your parents, though doesn’t sound like they are very receptive, could recommend “For the Bible Tells me So” http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0912583/ can be viewed for free on youtube.
88.
Gregory in Salt Lake City | February 9, 2010 at 9:36 am
Cassie, good for you throwing away that literature! :) another recommendation to you is “Prayers for Bobby” can watch free on youtube.
89.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 9:38 am
To “Prayers for Bobby” I would add “For The Bible Tells Me So.” I think it might also be on YouTube, but it is definitely on Netflix.
Love,
Fiona
90.
Alan E. | February 9, 2010 at 10:52 am
If you are going to watch Prayers for Bobby and are prone to tearing up, make sure you have a box of tissues nearby. I love Sigourney Weaver and she did a fantastic job!
91.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 10:57 am
I love that movie…i posted the trailer on another thread….my mother can’t watch that movie because it reminds her of the 2 times i tried to kill myself and the 3rd time when she stopped me…barely…but yeas have at least 4 boxes of tissues.
92.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 9, 2010 at 9:33 pm
Then I guess it’s a good thing I have a Sam’s Club membership, isn’t it? There I can get a case of tissues for the price of a six-pack.
93.
Ozymandias ('cause it's cooler than 'Elbert') | February 9, 2010 at 11:46 am
“Prayers for Bobby” is absolutely heart-wrenching… but it’s something that every Christian should see!
Love,
Ozy
94.
rpx | February 9, 2010 at 2:07 pm
I wouldn’t hold my breath hoping the church would publish your current opinions…
95.
Cassie | February 9, 2010 at 9:40 am
It’s not your fault at all. Like you said, you were just slightly ignorant, and you were trying to fit the mold that had been made for you. I tried and fought to fit my whole childhood, by ignoring my feelings. When I realized what I was feeling, I tried to shove them away by hurting myself. But I’ve realized the ignorance and hypocricy and hatred of the church and want nothing more to do with it. I’m happy I have figured it out at 17, rather than 35. I am slightly jealous that you were excommunicated. You don’t have to deal with people begging you to come back (do you?). I know that when I go to college my records will be transfered to my student ward, and if things go as planned, I will never go. But I know that I’ll have to deal with members, and visiting teachers, and home teachers coming to my dorm and apartment telling me to come back, and “serving me” so that I might come back…I don’t want to deal with that. I’m pretty damn sure that the chuch will NOT let you publish an updated/modified version. That would be telling people the truth, that being LGBT is okay, and that it’s okay to love LGBT for who they are, not just loving them as a sinner. And that is NOT okay…according to the 0church.
Do you think you could send me a link to where I can find your article from 1997? I’d like to read it now, knowing what I know now about you. I really am so happy for you, I really am. I’m glad you know what you know and that you are doing well now. You make me know that I can be okay and have an actual life. Thank you.
96.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 10:34 am
Dear Cassie:
My understanding is that you can ask to have your name removed from the rolls (my parents converted to LDS when I was an adult, FWIW). Once that happens, “visiting teachers” are guilty of harassment under the law. You tell them to go away; if they come back, they are trespassing.
I can tell you that you will be okay and have a wonderful life. If you still want a church relationship, you may need to find it somewhere *outside* of LDS (perhaps a United Church of Christ or Metropolitan Community Church congregation, both of which are well known for their advocacy on LGBT issues).
My thoughts are with you.
Love,
Fiona
97.
Gregory in Salt Lake City | February 9, 2010 at 11:46 am
Hi again Cassie. I requested to be excommunicated. I was taught how empty I would feel without the gospel in my life, the opposite is true for me…but that story will need to wait for my blog to catch up…I’ve posted several times I’m going to get busy blogging…I better do it then! About article: go to LDS.org and search for “Becoming Whole Again” Can also click on my name to go to blog.
98.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 10:32 am
Dear Friends:
In a different thread, Bill asked if I would tell my own story about how I became an ally for equality. It was hard to write, frankly, but I am glad I did it. I went back and found that post so that I could share the information again here. We have new posters, and they may not have gone deep into the archives.
As I have said already, your stories humble me. The courage that you all show in the face of social stigma, bigotry, hatred and violence is a lesson to all.
And with that, here is what I shared previously.
I have a bisexual nephew whom I love dearly. One of my cousins is a lesbian (long story — we knew each other for about 10 years before discovering that we were related, LOL). My best friend for many years was a gay man (we have drifted apart, as sometimes happens with friendships). I have LGBT friends from many walks of life; I did a lot of theatre, and that’s how I met most of them. I was engaged to a man who is now a transwoman. The matron of honor in my wedding is bisexual. The father of my niece and nephew by marriage is gay. One of my favorite cousins was gay, and he suicided because of the homophobia he faced every day.
In other words, these are my friends and loved ones.
I also walked away from the church in which I had loved when it became affiliated with Dobson’s “Focus on the Family” — and started preaching anti-gay rhetoric. I wrote about some of that experience in an essay that has been published by several MCC Congregations since I first wrote it at the request of our local MCC minister. http://mccsj.org/?p=731
I have survived bullying in school and the workplace. I have survived domestic violence and sexual assault. I have been victimized for being “other.” While I do not and would not dare to compare what that was like for me with what LGBT people face in their daily lives, what those experience *did* do was teach me an awful lot about where compassion lives. It sure didn’t live in the church that told me to go home and be a better woman because then my 6′5″ fiance “wouldn’t need to” beat the crap out of 5′1″, then 100-pound me.
I did learn that real Christian compassion lived in a little tiny MCC congregation, where I was welcome despite being straight, having been a practicing pagan for years … and where the first person who spoke to me the day I showed up was a transman who said “Welcome home, sister. I am so glad you are here today.” I burst into tears because *no one* had ever done that in a church I attended. Ever.
So, what’s my personal stake in this? Aside from knowing that my rights could potentially be at stake if women become next on the “groups we love to hate” hit parade? It’s that these are my friends and loved ones who are being told that they aren’t good enough. That they don’t deserve the same rights as everyone else.
That is not okay. It is NEVER okay to hate someone for their mere existence. Hate me because I gave you a reason if you will, but because I was born? That’s just not a good enough cause.
I have mentioned before that my parents are Mormon; they converted when I was an adult. One of the things I learned about how to treat people was by an example set by my dad (and trust me, we did not always have a great relationship). When I was 8 years old, in 1972, my dad gave away the bride at a wedding her own parents refused to attend. The groom was a young, African-American man who was one of my dad’s students at Job Corps, and the bride was Caucasian. My daddy stood up there with them because it was the right thing to do. He was a POW in Viet Nam and has a lot of problems as a result … but when it’s time to do the right thing, he is always there.
How could I NOT stand up for my LGBT friends’ right to marry the person they love?
This has been harder for me to write than I thought it would be; tears are welling up, and have just now spilled over while I wrote about my daddy.
Thank you for asking me to tell you. I hope what I wrote was not incoherent.
Love,
Fiona
99.
Shlee | February 9, 2010 at 10:42 am
Fiona,
Thank you for sharing your story as well. I am always blow away by straight allies that not only support us but are also willing to stand up and fight. I’m proud to consider you part of my family of choice.
Love,
Shlee
100.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 10:48 am
Shlee, it is my honor. I had someone tell me once (I have said this before too) that as a hetero married woman that I don’t have a place in this issue. I told that person that I care too much about humanity *not* to concern myself.
Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter. — Martin Luther King, Jr.
Love,
Fiona
101.
Ronnie | February 9, 2010 at 10:59 am
Fiona64….Have ever told you you’re my hero (singing)…lol
102.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 11:04 am
Ronnie, you are my hero too. All of you are. I know I’ve said it over and over, but the courage every single one of you has shown humbles me beyond my ability to express.
Love from your ‘dopty-Mom,
Fiona
103.
Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 9, 2010 at 9:27 pm
Thank YOU, fiona, for sharing your story. This has only reaffirmed my vote for you to be the face of the marriage equality movement. Whatyou wrote was very coherent to me, and very beautiful. Again, thank you, sis.
104.
Shlee | February 9, 2010 at 10:32 am
I’ve been lurking around and so I feel I should share my story as well. Though it’s certainly much different from the other stories that have been posted here.
I originally came out to my parents my junior year of high school and while they weren’t okay with it they didn’t completely flip. They encouraged me to go and see a counselor because they weren’t sure how to help me. It didn’t go so well but I appreciated their attempts at being supportive. I never really dated in high school or through most of college so my bisexuality became something we never talked about. I didn’t bring it up because I didn’t think it was that important so long as I was single. I just didn’t want to open that can of worms. Over the years I argued with my father about gay marriage and don’t ask, don’t tell and actually made some headway in changing his mind, but when I left for college I sort of gave up the fight.
Flash forward to my senior year of college. I met this incredible woman (whose name ironically is also Ashley) and fell in love. This necessitated coming out to my parents again which was a painful experience because we are so close and I had been keeping that part of myself from them. My dad still wasn’t pleased but said he would try because he didn’t want to ruin our relationship. My mom was much more accepting, as was my younger sister. It was hard dealing with dad because I didn’t want to push him, but at the same time I couldn’t understand why this had to be such a big deal.
After graduating I moved from Asheville, NC to Chicago, IL for grad school and Ashley and I decided to try the long distance thing since she is still in undergrad. Over Christmas break I came out to both sides of my family and they were much more accepting that I ever could have hoped for. This past Sunday Ashley and I celebrated our one year anniversary.
I know that I am incredibly lucky to have a family that accepts and supports me. Ashley unfortunately isn’t so lucky. Her family is very souther baptist and her mother regularly either states or implies that she will be going to hell if she doesn’t change her ways and stop living this sinful lifestyle. I hope that as our relationship progresses she’ll be able to start thinking of my family as our family since they’re already chomping at the bit to meet the woman that makes me so happy. I also wish more than anything that I could share my family with all of you here. Everyone deserves to be loved and supported by their family, and it breaks my heart to read all of the stories posted here where that isn’t the case. If nothing else I take heart at the fact that we’ve created our own family here. Even though I don’t post much having all of you out there fighting for this cause has made me feel so much less alone in this new city. In a way I really do love you all.
<3 Shlee
105.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 10:37 am
Dear Shlee:
Thank you for telling your story.
You may have noticed that many of us sign our posts “Love.” That started pretty early on in the trial, when we realized that no one on the Prop 8 side was talking about love as a reason to marry. It is, of course, all about love. So many GLBT young people are thrown out of their families, where they should be receiving unconditional love. It is indeed a joyful thing that a family of choice can be found right here on this site.
Love from your straight ally,
Fiona
106.
Elizabeth | February 9, 2010 at 10:55 am
I’ve had such a problem trying to share my story and why being able to be married is so important to me with my best friend (and roomate). I’ve not yet been able to have that conversation without very quickly getting defensive or aiming for the throat, so to speak. Reading these stories have really helped me find and focus on that common ground.
Love,
Elizabeth
107.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 11:01 am
Dear Elizabeth:
I think it’s great that you have a roommate whom you feel like you can trust to tell your story when you’re ready.
I am confident that, when the time is right, you will be able to speak from the heart and tell your truth.
Love,
Fiona
108.
Cassie | February 9, 2010 at 11:23 am
I’m gonna go out on a random limb and tell my two favorite lesbian movies. (Sorry boys, never seen one with gay boys because my friend who shows them to me is lesbian, like me.) Imagine You and Me is an amazing love story with a beautiful ending. Loving Annabelle (annabel?) Is the best movie EVER, but has an abrupt ending. Seriously, if you like girls, watch these movies. :P
Those are the only two lesbian movies I’ve seen. Does anyone know any other lesbian movies that are amazing? Or any movies that have LGBT people or issues? I don’t have much access right now, but in 7 months I’ll be in college! Help me out…haha. :P
109.
fiona64 | February 9, 2010 at 11:29 am
I watched a beautiful movie just a week or so ago called “Unconditional Love,” in which Kathy Bates plays a housewife with a crush on a pop singer (Jonathan Pryce) who is murdered in Chicago, where she lives. She decides to go to England to the funeral, where she meets the singer’s partner (Rupert Everett). The two of them decide to find the singer’s murderer. It is a beautiful story, and very sensitive to LGBT people (and many populations that have been “othered” by society at large). I think you would like it.
Love,
Fiona
110.
Ozymandias ('cause it's cooler than 'Elbert') | February 9, 2010 at 11:45 am
I posted a synopsis of my experience elsewhere, but wanted to contribute again here (and add some more details):
I was born in Oklahoma to hearing-impaired parents. I learned from an early age what discrimination was like because my mom’s struggles after her divorce (the phrase ‘deaf and dumb’ was her generation’s ‘That’s so Gay!’ phrase and people believed it!). She nonetheless pushed me to excel in sports, school, and Cub Scouts.
My mom went to a non-deaf college to get her business degree, and quickly became friends with a wide variety of friends – Atheist, Muslim, Hindu, gay, straight, it didn’t matter to her. It was tough for her when I came Out – not so much because of any implied ‘immorality’ but because she was afraid for me – one of her Gay friends had been murdered in a classic example of Gay bashing, and local police turned a blind eye to it as long as they could.
For myself, I grew up in the Seventh Day Adventist church. Mom was supportive of me, and I quickly devoured all the cool bible stories I could (loved telling kids about the story of the Canaanite King that was so massive that the sword that killed him was lost in his bulk) and generally irritating the teachers by asking questions that had no easy answers (‘Teacher, where did dinosaurs come from?’).
Puberty was a tough time for me. I realized pretty quickly that the ‘funny feeling in my tummy’ only happened when I looked at guys, not girls. I didn’t know what ‘Gay’ even was at the time – though it wasn’t long until I started hearing about ‘those immoral Gays’ dying of HIV/AIDS while televangelists went on TV to say it was God’s will to eradicate them. When I realized that they were talking about ME I was absolutely terrified – Leviticus was suddenly treated as Gospel, and that was the first time I ran into the closet… I came out to my mom when I was 19 and if anything, she was afraid more for what might happen to me, considering the stand that Christian churches were taking about me, without even knowing it. For the longest time, she was the only person who knew.
I fell in love for the first time when I was a sophomore – he was in my HIgh School, and we quickly became best friends. To this day I can remember every conversation we had, every time I went to his house to play video games (Atari 2600 fans represent!) and played sports together. I tortured myself about coming out to him – yet I didn’t. We were in a very conservative private school, and I just couldn’t bring myself to do it. What if he was straight? What if he recoiled? Worse – what if he told everyone else? So, I kept silent. The word ‘regret’ does a poor job of describing how I feel, now 20+ years later, especially since I believed (and still do) that he was also Gay… but was AFRAID to take that chance. After that year, his mother yanked him out of school (she really didn’t like me being around… maybe she suspected) and I never saw him again.
I spent my Junior and Senior years building up my stamina – working out, doing track and field – because I was preparing to enlist. I had wanted to be in the Air Force as a kid, but having poor vision barred me from becoming a pilot, so I gravitated to the Marine Corps. The idea of being ‘One of the few, the proud, the Marines’ really resonated with me. I met my recruiter, who just impressed the hell out of me – 5 feet 1, petite lady, yet she just COMMANDED respect. I was amazed, particularly when she took the time to show me her high school senior photo. If the Marines could make a leader out of a bookish shy girl, what could they do for me? Obviously, it was not to be – I began reading newspaper articles about ‘rampant homophobia’ in the Armed Forces, and despite my excellent ASVAB test scores, I was crestfallen and regretfully told the recruiter that I had changed my mind – and refused to explain why.
After a few years, I found a church that seemed to be very welcoming. I was still very much in the closet, so I figured I could be a member and just ignore the anti-Gay rhetoric I heard from the members. It was during this time that I got involved (after much kicking and screaming, mind you) in the church’s youth ministry. I loved working with these kids, teaching them about respect and how ‘others’ didn’t mean ‘bad’ (which raised more than a few eyebrows among the adult members). At no time did I ever come Out to these kids – the very idea of having parents suddenly panic and pull these kids out of a group they desperately needed was awful. But, I started to worry – what if I was Outed? What if something happened? What if? What if? So, I put myself through the hell of ‘conversion therapy’ because of that fear (and then added a generous amount of guilt because it didn’t work – ‘lack of faith’ and all that). After a year of this abuse (and it was absolutely abusive in a psychological sense), I stopped going because I could tell I was getting absolutely nowhere.
I dated girls, not because I was sexually attracted to them (obviously I wasn’t), but because the fear drove me to ‘prove’ my non-existent heterosexuality and ended up hurting them because I just couldn’t maintain my interest – yet I was terrified to tell them why. Yet more guilt to add to the fear.
There have been so many opportunities lost, avenues not taken and experiences denied because of that fear – which still pervades today. For example, I’m not Out fully at work – not yet, anyway. I’ve made a lot of progress in coming out and being honest with myself and those around me. This fear is evil, insidious and has spread itself to every facet of my life – the work I do to undo that fear will be a long process, but despite the risks and the pain I am happier now than at any point in my life and look forward to greater contentment and peace within..
Love,
Ozy
111.
CJ | February 9, 2010 at 4:58 pm
Reading these stories, is amazing. Though i don’t feel right reading them without giving my own.
To start with i’m american, but i haven’t lived in america since i was 11. I now live in Ireland. Both my parents are Irish, but i was born in america, and have called it my home for a long time.
When i was a kid i didn’t have any older brothers, i was the first, so i didn’t really have kind of an older role model who would go out with girls. Anyway, it wasn’t til i was in Ireland that i thought about relationships. I didn’t want one when i was a kid, I just knew they existed. But it wasn’t til i was around 14-15 that i realized i was attracted to men. When i did, i was mostly confused and not so much scared. I didnt know what homosexuality was at the time, never mind what to DO with a man! But as time went on my understanding of it grew and it wasn’t til i wanted a relationship that i came out. I lived in a small town, so if i wanted a relationship i knew i would have to tell someone. So i told my friends at the time….I was scared out of my mind and almost sick. But they didn’t care. So i came out at 16 to my friends. The school i was in had its share of bullying, and the words gay and fag were thrown around but, i knew that when it was being used offensively by the students in my school, it was just a word. Most of them didn’t really care they justed were using it as a way to hurt people. Oh at this point i should probably mention that my school along with most schools in Ireland was a single gender catholic school.
But the principal, a priest, was awesome. He cracked down on bullying hard, and was still kind to all students, even the bully’s(cept when they were being punisched). An ex of mine was once outed in that school, and the principal called him into the office, and said to him, “If there is anyone bullying you, just come straight to me and let me know.”
Anyway, coming up to my finals in that school (we don’t really have “graduations” at that level of education here, I made a promise to myself, that on the day of my final exam i would tell my parents that i was gay. And i did! They were taken aback for a moment, but they weren’t mad, or sad, or scared. They were confused at first, but they didn’t mind.
After that, i was finally “free”, i didnt have to worry about being outed to my parents. Now im 19 and close to receiving a degree and graduating, i have wonderful boyfriend, and i am the LGBT society president in my college. But the strangest thing is that it makes sense when i say, “I am so happy/lucky that my family loves me.” Cus thats the love thats meant to be “unconditional” but so many it isnt. And even with my luck, i still stare at the country i call my home, angry with the pety quibble that simple unconditional love, that is a family, is constantly being persecuted and “defined”. I remember when i was a kid, and saw Barney on the tv, saying “Families come in all shapes in sizes”. So i will continue to look at the face of adversity, continue to be different, continue to just say “F*** off” to anyone that doesnt like me and feels like i should care. Cus thats the Irish-American way.
Sorry this was so long, but thanks to anyone who read it!
Oh and Cassie, YOU ARE AWESOME AND STRONG
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Gregory in Salt Lake City | February 9, 2010 at 5:11 pm
CJ – with young persons like you and Cassie I have great hope for our future. I’m glad the truth “Its OK to be Gay” is getting out there across the globe. Best of everything to you!
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Alan E. | February 9, 2010 at 8:39 pm
I finally have the time to stop reading periodically and write out my story. Much of my memory is key points that have stuck with me that may be fairly insignificant, but I surely can’t forget them. I was born on May 31, 1984 in Morgantown, West ‘by god’ Virginia, and my family moved to Saint Albans, just outside the capitol Charleston (this is the same town that Richard grew up in but in a previous generation. Small world). I went to a small Catholic elementary school (St. Francis of Assisi, Richard), and I don’t recall any animosity there. There are a few key things that stick out in my mind.
In 5th grade, I made a comment about a little 1st grader who was all dressed up for something for church. I said out loud that he looked cute, an I meant it in an adorable way. The girls sitting next to me were quick to tell me “Boys don’t call other boys cute.” I also remember being in the locker rooms at summer camp and having the urge to check out the other boys when we were changing to go in the pool. I still never acknowledged that I might be gay.
My mom likes to remind me of one of the first things that clued her in. I already knew that my uncle was gay, but at 10 I didn’t really know, let alone care, what that meant. Well I came up to her one day and asked what “faggot” meant. I don’t recall where I heard it, but she told me without question what it meant and that it was not nice to call people that because it was hurtful.
At one point I had messed around with one of my cousins. To his day I still think he is at least bi, though he is married now. I remember one time he asked if I had ever seen my (gay) uncles kiss? He said that he had and that it was weird, but I think he was interested because he brought it up out of nowhere one day. Other than that, we had gotten along very well and never had problems communicating. I went to his wedding, his wife is very sweet, and I brought my husband (“partner” at the time) with me. He was obviously very uncomfortable and only said one sentence to me. We had talked after I came out just fine, but on this day, he wouldn’t say much or look me in the eye.
Anyways, enough about others and more about me…
After leaving the small elementary school, I moved up to a much larger Catholic school, but only 3 friends went with me. I was an outside , and was quickly singled out to be picked on and bullied by all the other kids. They called me faggot and other gay slurs and comments, made fun of my nerdiness, and found any other reason to pick on me. Already being an emotional kid, it got to the point where I left school on tears nearly every day, which of course didn’t help matters. The counselor weren’t much help. They had too many other kids to work wih and I guess they figured me a lost cause. I knew deep down that I was gay, but I again I never ackowledged it or suppressed it (a common them in my and many people’s youth). I tried dating a girl, but I was uncomfortable with the situation and freaked when she tried to kiss me. We didn’t last long after that.
I got so fed up that I decide to write a letter to all of the kids that were bullying me. Before I wrote the letter, I took note of their locker numbers so I could just slip it in (that’s what he said; needed a little pickmeup). Well I never got to the letter because one kid found my notebook with all the names and locker numbers, so they claimed that I was out to get them and would do somehing bad to all those on the list. Needless to say, but everyhing just went downhill even further for the rest of the year, progressing to more physical encounters instigated by the same people.
Luckily for me, my dad got a new job in Richmond, VA. We moved that summer. The entire break, I had a chance to reflect. I was handed an opportunity to start new and present myself in whatever manner I wanted to people who had no idea who I was. I decided that I would stop being introverted and would approach most everyone with an extroverted, open mind. I didn’t have a 100% record for being open-minded, but I was pretty close. I certainly didn’t want to treat anyone the way I had been treated the previous year. This turning point has set the mold for the rest of my life.
Things started going very well for me. I went to another catholic school for 8th grade, and then got into a highly competitive charter school for high school. I still pretended to be straight, though at that point I knew. I was looking at gay porn and fantasized about other boys. My dad had discovered my history on the computer and even confronted me asking if I was gay. I said no even though I kept looking it up and he would eventually catch me again. The worst lines that stay with me were “Do you know what gay guys do to have sex? It’s gross and disgusting.” or “Are you a little faggot?” To give him a little credit, he did get better, but that’s another story because he’s still a frat boy in a mid-50′s body.
To back up a little, I was involved in Boy Scouts from Tiger Cub up to Eagle. As much as I know about the Scouts now, I am still eternally grateful for the experiences and things I learned. I take comfort in knowing that I could be ready for just about anything and keep my cool. I did have a few experiences in the tent, too. Even with this, I still wouldn’t let myself believe that I was gay.
I tried dating girls in high school. I was a cross country and track runner, and I looked good with a mix of nerdiness. My sophomore year, I was on a date that ended in a bad car accident. I did suffer a level 2 concussion and can’t remember most of it, but I was told that I went into instant Boy Scout mode and braced the neck of my girlfriend until the paramedics arrived because she complained about it hurting. I didn’t notice any other I’ll effects from the accident, luckily, and everyone was ok in the end. If one of us was sitting in the front passenger seat we would have been killed, though. The dent went all the way to the center console to picture the extent of the crash.
I had great friends in high school. I never dared try to mess around or even approach anyone about my inner thoughts for fear of repeating the 7th grade experiences. I wanted my life to continue as smoothly as high school would allow. There was one guy who came out, and in my mind he was really gay. I guess I also didn’t want to be compared or equated to him. He always fascinated me though. In retrospect, I wish I had the courage then to come out like he did and be whoever he wanted. I respected most about him that he studied so many languages and was even talking to the FBI about training after high school.
The Tuesday before Thanksgiving in my Senior year, I was in another bad car accident. A large, U-Haul-sized truck pulled out in front of me when I was doing about 40-45 (the speed limit), and I nailed the side hard. I stretched the seatbelt and hit my face and chest on the steering wheel. I credit being alive to my old Volvo. The front end was crushed to at least half and only moved into the cap by a couple inches. I later found out that I had a deviated septum and some bruising, but I didn’t notice much else personally.
I guess I could review myself well, because from that point on, my grades crashed. From then to the end of the year, I skipped one class at least 44 times. I had weird sleep patterns, and would sleep in frequently. If it weren’t for the attendance councelor calling to wake me up, I probably would have missed more classes. My mom noticed the changes and sat me down one day. We mutually agreed that I should go get checked out. It turned out that I was falling into a depression as a result of the car accident that was amplified by the fact that I had now suffered two major head injuries. I was kicked off the track team for my grades and I barely graduated high school. This didn’t help matters of course. I was taking Zoloft and was visiting a psychologist to see if we could determine if any major changes in my head were taking place.
I took off the year after high school. I got a job at a dog day care, which was an absolute blast. It was a busy job, and it took some growing up to deal with the real world issues outside of school. I gained a lot of confidence to the point where I was ready to come out, sort of. I sat down with three of my closest friends one night when we were hanging out. I turned off the TV and said we had to talk. One friend said, “you’re gay?” At that point I said, “Close. I’m Bi.” I knew this wasn’t the whole truth, but this was the most open I had been about my feelings ever. Before that night I had wanted to tell them many times. I would yell at myself on the drive home many nights for being a coward. We didn’t talk much about it that night except that I “liked the best of both worlds” (half truth). That drive home I was so proud of myself. I really wanted to come out and say I was fully gay, but I was almost there. I cheered and danced and sang. Nothing in my life had been harder to deal with, and I came through fine. They didn’t hate me or disown me, and I was onto a new part of my life. The next thing to do was to tell my mom.
I took an extra long lunch one day and took her out to eat. Early on I just came out and told her that I thought I was at least Bi, of not gay, but I wasn’t sure which yet. Her response, and I will forever love her (and playfully scorn) for it, was “I’ve always suspected it.” I was so upset that she didn’t say anything earlier because it would have made my ordeal so much easier! Now I’m glad she didn’t because it made me a stronger person. She wanted me to make sure that this is what I truely wanted in spite of all the shit that gay people have and had to put up with.
I tried going to school the next year, but fell into an anti-social depression and messed that up. Expensive mistake. I was able to be open about being gay though. After that it was difficult to get into school mode. After coming home I got an apartment and tried to work and go to community college. I could never get the school part, but I was paying attention to lessons from working. I began another reflection phase in my life. I stopped taking the Zoloft mainly because I wanted to enjoy sex and masterbation again. I took hold of the reigns in my life though.
About a year later, I took a trip with some friends to San Francisco. While there, I happened to run into my counterpart in life, Brandon. We almost didn’t meet each other. For all you SF folks, we met on the back patio of The Mix in the Castro. He had just driven back from LA that day and was dragged out by his friend. We had a barbecue at his house the next day with his little Webber Simpsons grill. I had to leave the next day, but we both didn’t want me to leave. We ended up talking on the phone every day, and a month and a half later, Brandon flew out to Virginia to visit. That visit was too short, so I flew out to SF again in another month and a half, still talking every day.
After another back and forth trips, Brandon asked me to move out with him. I had heard plenty of stories about people who had moved to San Francisco and then fallen apart. I had fallen in love, and I found the best person to hang out with and share my experiences. We have some similar interests, which helps, but we had made that connection. The next summer, I drove across the country with my brother (he flew back) to start a new chapter. We eventually got married on Nov. 3, 2008 and have been together going on 5 years now, and I can count on one hand the number of arguments we’ve had. I have found the person I want to spend the rest of my life with. We inspire each other. Nobody can tell me that my relationship has any less meaning. I am looking forward to our future journeys together.
Sorry this is so long, but I wanted to get my whole story out there. I
m sure I missed some key parts, but I am writing this on my iPhone, so it’s hard to edit. Please share more stories. I enjoy reading and hearing new perspectives and seeing where I relate and where I am different. You have all given me new perspectives that I couldn’t possibly imagine. Also, friend me on facebook if you like. I have had a great time wih his community this past month.
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Richard Walter (soon to be Walter-Jernigan) | February 9, 2010 at 9:32 pm
Alan, from one ‘Red Dragon’ to another, you did very well. And no, you did not have to go to or graduate from SAHS to be a Red Dragon. All that is required is that you have lived in St. Albans. And yes, I know where St. Francis of Assisi Parish/School is. I went to two weddings there, and used to go to bingo every week with Mom. And the pastor and his assistant when I was living in St. Albans were lovers. EVeryone knew it, but noboby cared, because they were just another middle-aged married couple.
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fiona64 | February 10, 2010 at 6:29 am
Dear Alan:
Thank you for sharing your story. Depression is an awful burden to bear (BTDT, no medication helps mine). I applaud your courage in not only sharing your coming-out story but also in sharing about your depression. Mental illness has stigma of its own; we are taught to be ashamed of it. It is no shame.
Love,
Fiona
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Alan E. | February 10, 2010 at 7:11 am
It was an important part of my reflection process, and has helped shape me as I am today. It really took giving myself a swift kick in the ass to get over it, and I have found many venues to keep myself interested and happy in life. I think being honest with myself and others, not just being gay but with my other interests too, is critical.